Monday, June 13, 2016

Blog Banter 76 - Tanky McTankFace

Welcome to the continuing monthly EVE Blog Banters and our 76th edition! For more details about what the blog banters are please visit the Blog Banter page.

Blog Banter 76 - Tanky McTankFace

At fanfest CCP Fozzie proposed a potential new ship class. Let's call it the fleet commander's flagship for now. This is to try and prevent "FC Headshotting" where the opposing fleet knows who the FC is and alpha's them off the field leaving the rest of the fleet in confusion and disarray. Fozzie mentioned a ship with a great tank but no offensive abilities. Is this a good idea? Is FC head-shotting a legitimate tactic? If CCP do go down the route of a "flagship" how might this work? Also is a new ship the answer or is there another way of giving an FC the ability not to be assassinated 12 seconds into the fight without letting players exploit it?

Banter on...


Contributors...

Grimmash on Gaming - Blog Banter 76: Whither Flagships?
The Wormhole - BB76 - Tanky McTankFace
SCASS - BB76 - The FC's Flagship
Inner Sanctum of the Ninveah - Blog Banter 76 - Flagships
YADOT – A CAPSULEERS ADVENTURE - BB76 – The FC’s new chariot
The Ancient Gaming Noob - BB76 – The Sanctity of the Fleet Commander
Morphisat's Blog - Blog Banter 76 – Bull’s Eye
Posted by at 12:00 AM

12 comments:

  1. kanchoblindsideJune 13, 2016 at 2:45 AM

    Well, they always have an XO and never too many jumps away (unless in enemy/invaded NRDS space would be hard to return quickly, if at all). Good FCs may not want them, and others may not because they'll get no kills & cant fight. Shooting a target is also a default "target call". Easier for me to see whats being shot before they can call it with me checking the name and then me locking and firing. I still say "put it in game".

    ReplyDelete
  2. OddsodzJune 13, 2016 at 2:54 AM

    Hello there boys and girls.

    I have been doing that thing where you think you can beat DEV's at making things for Eve. Silly to try, I know. But every dog has it's day (no chucky nut bar for you Rimmer - Red Dwarf joke).

    Let's get on with it shall we.

    Ok so at Fanfest. CCP Fozzie and team proposed an idea that there maybe a new up comming ship that is designed for Fleet Commander to minimise or curb the tactic of "Head Shotting" fleet commander (the guy or girl directing the fleet to targets and so on) so as to destabilize an enemy fleet combat effectiveness. The premise is that by "Head Shotting" the FC off the field at the start of a battle, you can win a battle before it even gets really going. The fear is that when the FC is blow off the field of battle. Then major battles are not even fought. Long story short. It is believed that PVP in this manner is being suppressed as FC will not engage in big fleet battles because they can not stay on field to direct the troops even if losing the fight.

    So with that in mind. CCP has put forth the idea that a new ship my address this. I myself don't think so. Here is why

    If a new ship is designed, Then it will have to be a frigate sized hull. Anything bigger and you lock out PVP in novice sized combat sites in Faction Warfare systems in lowsec. But a frigate is not going to be the ship of choice when in battleship slug fest. Or any ship class above a frigate level sized hull. To address that you will not only need to design 1 ship. But a whole line of ships for each hull size and also for each race. That is a whole lot of DEV time and work.

    The possible solution

    Rework the "Target Spectrum Breaker". In its current from. The "Target Spectrum Breaker" is a poor module that fails to deliver on its promise as an "anti blob tool". Back when it was released it was advertised as a module to save solo or small gang battleships from getting blobbed to death. It sounded great. But in practise it fails completely.

    See here for how it fails

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oofwHuN5ydg&feature=youtu.be&t=284 (skip to 4.44 minutes)

    The biggest issue with the module is that when you use it. You are effectively ECM jamming yourself with no chance of ever escaping from a blob due to warp scramblers/disrupter cycle times. So to use it means that you can not shoot anything (drones still work), And so you can't kill any tackle that is holding you.

    The one thing the "Target Spectrum Breaker" does well is reduced incoming damage to a more manageable level. As seen here.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ijVClf29B2g

    But what good is tanking if you can't kill anything or even lock a target to shoot or direct fire for the fleet. A fleet commander needs to lock targets to direct fire for the fleet so he/she can assess if the target is a good choice. Things that a fleet commander needs to see is if the target is tanking the outgoing fire from his/her's fleet, What sort of tank type the target is using (armor or shield or manTank Hull). Things like this are important to fleet commanders.

    ReplyDelete
  3. OddsodzJune 13, 2016 at 2:54 AM


    My idea is to change the "Target Spectrum Breaker" from a battleship only module to a module that can be fitted to any ship class and also move from a mid slots to the high slots.

    Now here is why

    Removing to Battleship only rule means it can be fitted to any ship. That means all ship sizes in terms of hull can field them. Frigate battle in novice size complex will be doable.

    By making it a high slot module. You give the fleet commander a choice of more tank in the mids for shield doctrine ships. And more choice for tackle modules or EWAR. You also give choices for losing DPS and or utility high slots for better survivability against many target shooting you.

    Next thing is to remove the part that makes the module ECM jamming yourself. You must be able to lock targets to shoot and direct fire for your fleet.

    And the last part (and I know this will take up a lot of DEV time to figure out). The lock breaker effect should not effect your own fleet members. Yes this means that your own fleet members will be able to rep the fleet commander. And that is the point. To keep the fleet commander from being removed from the fight.


    Now. For some drawbacks to using this reworked module.

    I would not be opposed to things like when the module is active. The ship can't warp. Or your DPS from the ship is cut by 50% or even more. Or anything else that your guys can come up with.

    Fitting attributes should be adjusted as needed. I would also like to add that skill requirements up changed to so that "Wing Command 1" also be needed to fit the module.

    As for concerns that the module would become too powerful and be fitted to every ship everywhere. I would like to point out that DPS output would be greatly reduced from ships fitting this module. And that fitting this module in a small gang to flight another small gang* is an absolute disaster due to so few targets locking you to make the lock breaker effect worth it's fitting over more DPS or utility. As seen here

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N6rBuMu0zsY (be warned, I rage here. sorry).

    That is my idea. Thanks for reading.

    Oddsodz.

    edit.

    *Small gang = less that 15 ships in a fleet

    **Edit, As somebody pointed out on reddit, To stop whole fleets fitting this. I would impost that you must be in the "WING" or "FLEET" position in the fleet hierarchy for the module to work.

    ReplyDelete
  4. UnknownJune 13, 2016 at 4:00 AM

    How about a navy variation of command ships, it would have vastly increased resist's and hp, would be able to run 4 links and would not have any turrets or launchers nor could fit smart bombs.

    ReplyDelete
  5. AnonymousJune 13, 2016 at 6:27 AM

    I would use such ship to haul plex in high sec

    ReplyDelete
  6. GrimmashJune 13, 2016 at 5:45 PM

    Here ya go:

    http://grimmash.com/2016/06/13/blog-banter-76-whither-flagships/

    ReplyDelete
  7. Kirith KodachiJune 14, 2016 at 8:57 AM

    http://www.ninveah.com/2016/06/blog-banter-76-flagships.html

    ReplyDelete
  8. AnonymousJune 14, 2016 at 9:20 PM

    My shot:
    https://yadots.wordpress.com/2016/06/15/bb76-the-fcs-new-chariot/

    ReplyDelete
  9. Wilhelm ArcturusJune 15, 2016 at 10:29 AM

    My dubious entry into the topic:

    https://tagn.wordpress.com/2016/06/15/bb76-the-sanctity-of-the-fleet-commander/

    ReplyDelete
  10. UnknownJune 17, 2016 at 1:22 AM

    My entry is over at
    http://www.sobaseki.com/wordpress/2016/06/17/blog-banter-76-bulls-eye/

    ReplyDelete
  11. Talvorian DexJune 17, 2016 at 6:53 AM

    And another one:
    http://targetcaller.blogspot.com/2016/06/bb76-are-fleet-commanders-special.html

    ReplyDelete
  12. UnknownJune 18, 2016 at 7:02 AM

    I argue for a different approach: Why should Eve persist in an Iron Age model for command, rather than moving up a millennia or so to a more Napoleonic model of command. Let's give our FCs a steed from which they can command from a distance.
    (http://evechecklist.blogspot.com/2016/06/bb76-field-marshal-upon-yonder-hill.html)

    ReplyDelete

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